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Post by Bill on Jan 14, 2012 7:49:09 GMT -5
;D Same thing I have always said, drop is not the problem. If your scope will dial it you will hit it. Like Ernie said, its the wind that will get you. Only way around that and its to use as high a BC bullet as you can. It won't over come the wind totally but it will minimize the drift. I'm now running a Caldwell wind meter and keep it right with the laser rangefinder. Without either of those you can get in trouble fast. Good hearing from you again Ernie.
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Post by Jack on Jan 14, 2012 10:04:46 GMT -5
"Drop is a constant. Drift is the fly in the ointment." I couldn't agree more. I don't shoot as far as some of you folks do- in my part of the country, where we have hills and woods, a 1500 yard shot is pretty much out of the question. The longest I've found is about 650 yards. I've killed some woodchucks at that distance. Not knowing any better, I used a 243. Getting the drop is a piece of cake, now that laser rangefinders are on the scene. Wind drift is what causes the misses. Particularly when the wind is in one direction where you are, then swirling around a knoll or patch of woods 200 yards downrange, so the wind is going in a different direction, and then maybe doing something completely different at the target. My observation about cartridges and loads is, that, out to about 400 yards, high velocity is what you want. Some of the hot .224 varmint cartridges like the 22-250 and others, do a great job. From 400 yards out, high BC is what you need to strive for. The higher BC cuts the wind drift at the longer ranges.
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Post by Bill on Jan 15, 2012 9:42:42 GMT -5
I have a friend of mine that I shoot with on occasion that shoots a AR15 Varmint with the HB and 1 in 7 Twist. He was trying to shoot a decent target at 100 yds and could not get it to shoot much less than an inch no matter what he did. I told him to forget about the 100 yd target and only worry about getting it shooting center of the target group which he did. We then moved out to 850 and he totally shocked himself on how the gun shot. He is using 70 grain JLK bullets and has to really neck the cases down to get enough neck tension so that the automatic does not jam a bullet back into the case. But when he tried a few things I asked him to try like annealing the necks, polishing the inside of the neck and not loading and leaving his ammo sit for 6 months prior to shooting his groups at 850 have improved considerably. But it took those skinny long high BC bullets to do it with his AR so that little bullet could buck the wind enough to make good consistent hits.
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bounce
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Post by bounce on Jan 15, 2012 10:47:51 GMT -5
I never noticed haveing wind problems when shooting my cannon over in to SD. LOL. Big arch but straght as an arrow lol. useing lead balls, useing pour a rock balls it was a plum flat trajecty all the way & no drift either, got to love them cement type balls.
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Post by deputydon on Jan 15, 2012 11:51:05 GMT -5
You were shootin' w/ the wind......
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bounce
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Post by bounce on Jan 15, 2012 16:53:24 GMT -5
East, north east, ? not likely. Was shooting down river and to the SD side around a long mile. Boy the cement balls were their just like that too, the lead we waited & waited lol. but they realy sent up a rooster tail when landing lol.
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Post by Bill on Jan 16, 2012 8:24:18 GMT -5
Ya but SD sucks and NE blows. That always helps those cannon balls get there. ;D ;D Thats what a guy told me the other day. ;D
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bounce
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Post by bounce on Jan 16, 2012 8:40:54 GMT -5
Sounds like Native wisdom to me lol.
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Post by twomoons on Jan 18, 2012 15:48:35 GMT -5
Darn right drop is constant, I am picking things off the floor alll the time! It takes real talent to dope the wind and a good spotter is worth his weight in gold.
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Post by Bill on Jan 19, 2012 9:41:24 GMT -5
Know what you mean about a good spotter. My hunting partner and I had been working together all summer getting ready for hunting season and we both had been working at making a shot at 1000 yds. When hunting season came around we both had scheduling problems and ended up hunting with a guy we work with and who was just getting started and had no idea how to call shots. My hunting partner got on a buck at 1040 yds and was elated as he was going to beat me to the 1000 yd mark. That is until he started shooting. The guy spotting for him had no idea where he was hitting or was not paying attention or what I think was he just didn't know how to call adjustments although we had worked with him on this a bit. His adjustments were High, Still High, What the hell you doing, your still high, No comment, No comment, Why did you quit shooting. The last was after my buddy just gave up as he could not figure out what the spotter was meaning and he just plain quit. The spotter than gave him crap about not being able to shoot. Your spotter needs to say HOW MUCH HIGH. I hunted with the same guy and got the same thing. LOW, LOW AGAIN, Ain't you adjusting? . Thank god I was able to see my hits on the last two shots and was able to adjust for them and make the hit as the info I had from him was worthless. When I called his shots he got the drops, how much windage, and his corrections. He made his shot at 600 yds.
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bounce
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Post by bounce on Jan 19, 2012 11:56:07 GMT -5
Lol, shop floor spotter Bill,lol. but we know what you mean.
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Post by xphunter on Jan 19, 2012 14:16:30 GMT -5
Having a spotter and shooter who are on the same page is essential for stress-free and accurate LR shooting. Need to teach the spotter NOT to tell the shooter where he hit, but rather the correction that is needed. And he needs to give the correction in either MOA or MILS. You can use the target as a reference as well, like, "right edge" or "favor right" (halfway between the bull and the edge). Having a spotting scope or rifle scope in either MOA or MILS is a tremendous advantage here.
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Post by Bill on Jan 20, 2012 9:25:11 GMT -5
For me he better be using MOA ;D I really get messed up on MIL's ;D Its not really hard to figure even if the spotter says you need to go up 30's At 800 it works out to almost 4 MOA and the math can be done in your head real easily. Now if he says you need to go up 30"s and your using Mil then you have to figure Hmmm 3.6" divided into Aww hell I"m lost already. Two weeks ago I was out shooting and another kid I taught to shoot out to 1000 was with me and I had not shot my gun since deer season and wasn't sure where my scope was set at. Thats another problem you have with scopes without zero stops. Wish Leupold would get on the bandwagon and install Zero stops. Anyway I fired off the first shot and he called up a 1/2. Second shot it was left 1/4 and third shot he called Hit. Man that was easy.
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Post by xphunter on Jan 20, 2012 10:30:18 GMT -5
Even communicating in inches is not good, since our turret's for distance are either MOA or MIL. Some turrets are IPHY, but even then telling a shooter correct 17" at 1K is something a shooter should never have to figure while on the gun. I will give you a holler and let you know a quick way to fix your zero stop problem
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Post by xphunter on Jan 20, 2012 10:31:33 GMT -5
The spotter must communicate in the language that the shooter is using to correct for distance.
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