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Post by Purebred Redneck on May 1, 2009 23:20:25 GMT -5
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Post by dovehunter on May 2, 2009 7:05:36 GMT -5
Red:
That's still a heck of a lot of money for something you probably wouldn't use all that much. I am also not that sure that the 2nd shot would be all that much of a benefit anyway. Why not just get a conventional, single-shot muzzle loader of some kind. It would probably serve you just as well and would probably be a lot cheaper. Just my opinion for what it's worth.
I didn't vote because I feel it's your money. If that's the way you want to spend, it's no skin off my back.
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Post by jabba on May 2, 2009 7:55:21 GMT -5
I always though one would be cool Red... but mostly as a "Look what I have"... and not as a functional piece.
Jabba
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Post by Jack on May 2, 2009 8:29:09 GMT -5
First thing I thought was 'Durn, that thing would be heavy'. Personally, I haven't felt handicapped with having only one shot in my ML. But, like Dovehunter says, it's your money.
I suspect regulating the point of impact would be a matter of fiddling with loads. I note that it's a 1-24 twist, so it's designed for sabot type loads I would guess, not roundballs.
I'm betting Twomoons can chime in with some real world experience....
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Post by jimiowa on May 2, 2009 9:16:27 GMT -5
Well it's definately got the "Cool Factor"!
I don't think 9.3 lbs is particularly heavy for a .72 Cal Slug Gun.
A healthy charge behind a heavy slug( what would a proper .72 cal slug weigh 500 grn- to 1 oz.) your going to want some weight to absorb recoil.
Should you get one? The question is would you use it or would you shoot it a few times and then be a wall hanger?
Part of me say's it's not my money and I have no problem seeing you spend yours. I would like to hear from someone who actually has one. The other side says why would a friend encourage a friend to blow money on something he would never use??
I have always thought if I had money to spend on something I had no practical application for, I would have a Dangerous Game Rifle?
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Post by klsm54 on May 2, 2009 9:55:14 GMT -5
Of course you should buy it. A man should always buy any gun that...
A. He's always had a hankerin' for....
and.....
B. He can afford without undue strain on his future well being.
To hell with logic, nobody needs to own more than three guns but how much fun would that be.
Regulated, in double gun lingo, is not a task that you will be performing. Double rifles are cross-eyed, so to speak. The bores of each barrel are pointed inward, ever so slightly, so that the shots from each barrel should hit in the center at a set distance, in this case 75 yards. It is not a function of load development.
Twomoons can tell you the specifics of the "regulating" process. If these guns are notorious for being poorly regulated, you may want to make arrangements to ship it straight to a competent gunsmith, like twomoons, for a tune-up.
But by all means, if a double barrel, .54 caliber, muzzleloader is something you have a desire to own, buy it. $300.00 off is nothing to sneeze at. And, after all, it is a .54, you can never go wrong with that. The only draw back I see is the twist rate. too fast for round ball (read cheap) shooting. But then again it will most likely never see real black powder or a projectile that's not in a sabot anyway.. ;D ;D
Don't dally, you know these aren't going to around long for this price. If you don't get this gun, you'll regret it forever.
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Post by Purebred Redneck on May 2, 2009 10:56:19 GMT -5
Some reports are the closest thing to regulation at 50 yards is about 15 inches of eachother. Now people may not know what they are doing. Worst comes to worse, you just have to flip sights inbetween shots. Do I really need it? Guns I do not have: varmint rifle centerfire revolver 30+ caliber big game rifle I would have preference to a 58 caliber should I ever go out of state for elk or black bear (have to make sure doubles are legal in some states - colorado they aren't I don't think). But a 54 should be plenty for an elk as I would be likely to shoot a cow or spike bull. Even a trophy bull should go down to a 400 grain bullet. I think this is where a second shot would be good as it's my understanding that elk never go straight down --- so what do you have to lose firing again? I only hunt with a muzzleloader so I'd get a bit more use than normal unless I go leasing land. The last 4-5 deer I killed with my 50cal single shot went straight down  Where the 2nd barrel would help is when the deer with them runs about another 50 yards, turn around, and look to see what's making all the noise. When you only see 1 group of deer all year long, a second shot "could" put a nice end to the season unstead of a longer disapointing one. The other example would be in the rain. If one barrel only goes "crack" instead of "crack booooooom", you at least have another chance if the deer lets you. Used guns are cheap too. You can pick up a used short barrel hawkin for 100-200 dollars to carry with you (I already take the kitchen sink in the woods so a second gun may as well come along too) But in general, no a second shot is not needed because I break them down with neck and shoulder shots. I don't know, maybe a double barrel shotgun for half the price would satisfy my wants of the "cool factor"  |
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Post by jmarriott on May 2, 2009 10:59:23 GMT -5
Under 1000 for a regulated double. Something is up with it.
Is it a single sight front and 2 rears? A single sight front and rear or a set of two sights per barrel? The more refined the sighting system the better.
I have experamented with some double barreled guns for slug shooting in Indiana. It is a lot harder to get the barrels regulated for two slugs at 50 yards or 100 yards than a shot string at 25 or 30 yards. Most ended up in getting a single barreled shotgun and reloading faster for a second sight. I did see one 20 guage over and under ruger that shot winchester roundballs downstream in very close distance to each other with a single sight. None of the few side by sides shot well with slugs we tried.
I think it is a neat idea. I don't know without a kentucky windage or double sight if it would be a grouper. Stick with the 75 yard mark for the barrel sighting in not 50 and 100 and see if it's a keeper. Well in a way if its blackpowder gun it is pretty much a keeper anyway. They don't normally resell well.
All the good mountain men carried Blackpowder african plains rifles in the traditional blackpower muzzy season.
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bounce
Royal Member
Posts: 5,727
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Post by bounce on May 2, 2009 13:06:09 GMT -5
Well Red if you don't buy it, You can always come pickup my over under 12ga x .58 made around 1850 in NY. for bear hunting. I'm not man enough to carrey it anymore, but it is impresive and the best thing is today it is haff price only $800.00 and comes with two iron ramrods one for each barrel carryed on each side and is a kentucky styled gun. Bores are in excilent condition And the bottom barrel the .58 is rifled the 12 ga top barrel is smooth. But then your probibly not man enouff for it either LOL. And you can't miss a bear at 50 yds, oups I forgot I'm talking to Red LOL.
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Post by deputydon on May 2, 2009 15:02:40 GMT -5
Welllllllllllllll Red you might want to check to see if it's legal for MLing deer in your state. Cause it wouldn't be in Nebraska the last time I checked. If it is BUY IT! If not SORRY TO RAIN ON YOU PARADE!!!!
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Post by jimiowa on May 2, 2009 15:15:52 GMT -5
Some reports are the closest thing to regulation at 50 yards is about 15 inches of eachother. Now people may not know what they are doing. |
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Post by twomoons on May 2, 2009 19:31:10 GMT -5
First off how is it rifled, for round ball or bullet? What are you going to use it for and where? Here in NE you can only load one barrel legal so why, but if you can load two maybe 10% of the time you will get some use out of the second tube. If you are buying it because you just read Stewart Edward White it won't matter. Keep in mind that the Kodiak are the BOTTOM of the double gun line. Mostly they don't even try and regulate them and they just slap on two sets of sights. They can be regulated to a degree by load and by judicious filing in, but if you are expecting to shoot the gun and have both tubes on you are heading for heartache. I had a 54 caliber Cabela's Kodiak. It had a quick twist and was shot with bullets. I finaly managed to get it to shoot to your specs a grapefruit at 50 and a pie plate at 100. A pie plate is 10" ! that is not accuracy. The gun is heavy and well it needs to be as with a bullet to get it close you will need upwards of 80 grains of FFg. Now the problem with me is I got to shoot a real double gun once and I am spoiled. The genuine article will hold a 4" group with both tubes at 100 yards with the right load. The gun I shot was German made in the 1860's and the first load we tried shot both barrels into 3" at 50 yards and the second put the balls touching. The gun was much better balanced and the stock was not oversized and clunky. The triggers had decent pulls, I'm sorry J B Wood but the Kodiak is a CLUNKER, it has NONE of the grace, charm and feel of a real double gun. I'ts like shooting a savage 311 and then picking up a fine shotgun like a Merkel or and AYA, you wonder why you ever wanted a Savage. Buy the rifle and I will bet that within a year you will be looking to get rid of it. Mine has at this point went through 4 hands and is still being worked on. The locks were smoothed and the trigger pulls set at 3 pounds. The gun was regulated and the sights changed from the dorky williams flip ups to real express sights. The stock was reshaped and the huge hollow in the butt filled with lead was filled wiht walnut and rebalanced. The chintzy dowel rod was replaced with hickory with ebony ends, and is still too flimsy, it needs a fine tapered steel rod. Sure it's fun to tote a double and dream of africa but if it niggles you everytime something isn't RIGHT you won't love the Kodiak.
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Post by Purebred Redneck on May 5, 2009 21:51:10 GMT -5
I'll have to pass for now.
There's too many bad reviews and with the way I'm feeling I won't be able to work with it too much.
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